P0410

[irishboy02]

Blew a code (P0410- as per scangauge). Secondar air recirculation. My motor sound like a dying cat for the first 30sec on a cold start until it kicks down. Is this pump system really THAT necessary? i understand what it does but its basically for only the first 20-30 sec and by it failing its throwiing off the timing. Would it be simplier and better to just remove the whole pump setup?

Input.

[Trail X]

I don't think the pump can affect your timing... unless the PCM is trying to adjust your A/F ratio based on the O2 sensor readings.

The secondary air injection only injects air directly into the exhaust to speed up the catalytic process inside the CAT, so it will affect your emissions, but shouldn't hurt your engine to disengage.

[irishboy02]

So no issues if i remove the pump completely? I havnt even taken a look under there yet. Removing the pump would that mean to block off that piping that runs to/from it or just can safely remove it with no problems

[The Roadie]

A failed SAIS pump cannot affect ANYTHING after start-up. It's only there to hasten the process of getting the cat and the heated O2 sensor up to temp and to get the PCM into closed loop mode where the emissions are controlled closer.

The OS has the longest thread on the subject, but there's only about six things that could go bad with the system. The exhaust manifold solenoid valve used to be a GM part only, and Dorman (bless their little hearts) is making a replacement now.

Engine noise that doesn't sound like a vacuum cleaner under the driver's seat is from something else. When you say "motor" do you mean the engine, or the SAIS turbine pump?

If you have emissions testing, removing the pump will cause you to fail it. And the permanent SES light might mean you miss out knowing if a NEW and serious problem comes up, unless you check for codes every few days.

[irishboy02]

heres a vid of what it sounds like...

http://s108.photobucket.com/albums/n11/Irishboy02/Mobile%20Uploads/?action=view&current=MOV-0070.flv

But now no code today...yet

[MrSmithsTB]

That must be a pleasure to wake up to What you need to do in pinpoint the source of the noise. Sounds like it could be one of two things. The pump itself is failing, or there is a leak that is causing the whistling noise while the pump is engaged.

[irishboy02]

Oh yes, i look forward to it every cold start.

So no objections if i was to just disconnect it?

[Trail X]

I'd try a few things...

First, unhook the tubes from your air pump and see if it is blowing air. With the tubes disconnected, does it make the whistling noise.

If it still makes the whistling, your pump is most likely the problem.

If it does not make the whistling and your pump is pumping air, most likely the air is being forced through some sort of restriction or hole in one of the lines and is howling. Connect the intake the exhaust lines from the SAI pump and see which line makes the noise. That should narrow you down some.

Your solenoid might also not be opening, which is causing the air to find another escape route, which is causing the howling.

[MrSmithsTB]

I'd try a few things...

First, unhook the tubes from your air pump and see if it is blowing air. With the tubes disconnected, does it make the whistling noise.

If it still makes the whistling, your pump is most likely the problem.

If it does not make the whistling and your pump is pumping air, most likely the air is being forced through some sort of restriction or hole in one of the lines and is howling. Connect the intake the exhaust lines from the SAI pump and see which line makes the noise. That should narrow you down some.

Your solenoid might also not be opening, which is causing the air to find another escape route, which is causing the howling.

No objections if you were to disconnect it, but I would recommend troubleshooting before pulling the plug.

[fishsticks]

On removal:

The air injection system on my LT1 F-body crapped out long ago and was removed. I had it programmed out when I had my PCM tuned. This was in OBD1 land though.


I wonder if such a thing could be done via PCM4Less and if it would pass the "Not Ready" style emissions check.

[irishboy02]

Before i left for work tday i crawled under there and disconnected the intake/exhaust pipe for it. They were a little sandy/dirty. I started it up and drove and It was quiet, but it wasnt a completely cold start. At 11 when i get out of work ill have a cold start and well see how it goes.

[foosh]

Just one more thing to add to your tb's ailments... you start a scrap book of it yet?

[irishboy02]

No but im thinking about starting one of my repair reciepts...

BTW, that alternator sound i thought, turns out to be this. The other morning it was REALLY loud and thats when i blew my code.

Im thinkin it mightv been caused by that tube dangling in my engine bay thats no longer connected to the intake Oops

[MrSmithsTB]

No but im thinking about starting one of my repair reciepts...

BTW, that alternator sound i thought, turns out to be this. The other morning it was REALLY loud and thats when i blew my code.

Im thinkin it mightv been caused by that tube dangling in my engine bay thats no longer connected to the intake Oops

Then why the hell didn't you reconnect it instead of disconnecting something else? Jeez, you north jersey guys.

[irishboy02]

Aayy wassa matta wit you you gotta fawkin problem wit meh


When i got my intake, it was off of an 04, i have an 05 so that extra hole was never there to connect (for the secondary recirc connection) and i never got around to drilling it.
Im pretty sure with all the dirt mud dust and sand that iv been through this has been far from clean purified air going in there.

Live and learn, this was my fault.

Cold start in a few minutes, we shall see what happens

[MrSmithsTB]

Fingers crossed for ya, kid.

[irishboy02]

So, i have both intake/exhaust pipes disconnected on cold start and its still screamin and i can hear it sucking. Problem #1 found, its the pump/compressor thingy. Drove 20min to my gf's house no problem

#2 Leaving my girls house, not so cold start i hear it a little bit but goes away quick. Crossed a section of road riddled with little potholes and bam SES light on, code P0410


As i stated previously, do i now clean the probably dirty piping get a new pump and call it a day or can i just disconnect it and thats it?
If i disconnect it how will the wires stand to water crossings?

Side notes: my Water temp was 191-193 on ride home, doesnt usually get that high. Relavent?

[Zero]

Im a little confused. you say you have an 05 truck but you have the secondary air hose????????? I have an 05, got my airaid intake in january, and I clearly remember not having an optional air line that must be connected. My intake did come with the xtra hole in the runner tube for those trucks that do have that air line, but the intake actualy came from the manf. with a plug in that hole.

Unless I am missing something here, you may want to go back over your install. As far as I know it wasnt till 06 or 07 that the trucks got that secondary air line thing.

[Trail X]

You never told us that you didn't have part of your SAI hooked up!! Think that may be part of the problem?

From the time you didn't have your SAI hooked up did you have the howling? If you properly install your intake does that alleviate your howling sound?

My 05 has the SAI. Maybe it was a running change partway through the year, Zero.

[The Roadie]

Teebes doesn't have the system in his '02. I have it in my '04. Zero, is yours a Canadian-bought vehicle? It may have been a US-only system introduced in '03 or '04. I think '05 was when they improved the solenoid valve to include a pressure sensor that would tell with certainty if the pump was running, not just depend on the O2 sensor reading to indirectly conclude it was pumping air into the exhaust manifold.