ready to begin

[skawtydog]

So James, you say i should go with skinnier tires for my application? Will this hurt me at all when i start getting in to offroading for fun, rather than just surviving the ride to work? I ask these questions because I'm just now starting to research wheel adapters, but if skinny is the way for me to go, functional-wise, then so be it!

I am totally open to anyone's opinions here, as the more people who are involved, the better informed decision i'll be able to make.

Thanks guys,
Skawtydog

[Trail X]

255 is a decent all-purpose width. Keep in mind that the wider your ties get, the more rolling resistance you get, thus the lower gas mileage. With my set up (255 width M/Ts), I regularly get 17 mpg on the highway (per the scangauge).

The other advantage to a skinnier tire, is less trimming. I have gotten away with zero trimming with my setup... if you get aftermarket wheels (almost always pushes the tires out more) with wider tires, you will certainly end up having to trim your fender.

Wider tires are nice if you are regularly on terrian with low shear strength (sand, deep deep snow, non-compacted soil, or deep deep mud). It's all a trade-off.

[skawtydog]

Excellent! and your point on the no trimming sounds great, just one less thing to worry about...i'm going to start researching my options here...and as usual, any suggestions are much appreciated.

Skawtydog

[skawtydog]

So if i put some "skinnier" tires on (255's for example) depending on my choice of tire profile, I may or may not need spacers...right? I read somewhere that wheel spacers cause excess strain on wheel bearings and can/will lead to premature bearing failure. Unfortunately, I can't remember if it was stated by a reliable source or just some Johnny Jack-@$$. What do you guys think.

Ok, just got up off of my ass, figuratively, and searched for that bearing/spacer issue and found a post by roadie which included the following:

"If your mission (trails, aggressiveness, buddies to wheel with) supports the need - get whatever you have to get to accomplish it." -the Roadie

regarding replacing wheel bearings every 50,000 miles instead of 100,000 miles due to spacer use. Good point, man. That puts it into perspective perfectly.

so here's what i have so far, albeit tentatively:

Full BDS kit
FRONT: Mark's 1/2" shim spacer, with Bilstein hd shocks, and the bds upper strut mounts.
REAR: BDS upper coil spring mounts & z71 springs (just need the bds mount here, right? and as i understand it, I should absolutely wait for the part number for the longer BDS shocks to go with the z71 springs, correct?)

AND: Wheel spacers all around, will decide on these as soon as i decide on my wheel/tire combo.

I think i would prefer not to use my stock wheels, as they are currently wrapped in my bfg a/t ta ko's, and would look goofy with the lift...besides, if i screw up some of the rim(s) and/or tire(s) while playing off-road, i want a set to fall back on for the daily-driving/grocery-getting part of my life.

But, choosing not to use stock wheels will change the offset of the spacers i need, i think...i am absorbing a lot of new info here...it's excellent to have this source of information, and you guys being so willing to help.

I know I ask an awful lot of questions, just want to do this thing right.


Skawtydog

[EwingJK]

So if i put some "skinnier" tires on (255's for example) depending on my choice of tire profile, I may or may not need spacers...right?

The limiting factor is tire diameter due to the upper control arm. The tire needs to be pushed out to clear this. The maximum tire diameter without a spacer is about 30", and thats cutting it close. With spacers, it can increase to about 33", depending on how much you want to lift and trim the body.

I'm currently running 255/75/16 with about 29.5" diameter. I don't have spacers.

Look at Item 1 in the attached diagram.

Front Suspension 050725TS06-100.gif

(46.41 KiB) Not downloaded yet

[Trail X]

Wheel spacers may in-fact make wheel bearings fail faster... hard to really determine this without lots of testing. I've had to replace one already, but that was about 30k miles after I put the wheel spacers on. So, slightly premature. You just have to deal with failures though. Your vehicle will have failures with or without the off-road equipment... just something you have to budget for.

It's your call about new wheels. Have you looked at the wheelspacers/adapters/wheels sticky in the wheels/tires forum? viewtopic.php?f=14&t=26

If you find a 6-lug aftermarket wheel, you can use a wheel spacer to change the lug pattern... this can open up your wheel options to any number of wheels. I'd caution you to limit your backspacing though... as your backspacing gets smaller, your tire sticks out further.

With an adapter you'd want to be as close to 6.5" of backspacing (without going over) as possible. Without an adapter (meaning a wheel with 6x127mm or 6x5" lug pattern) the wheel should be as close to 5" of backspacing.

Anyways, the sticky should explain most of that.

[The Roadie]

I've been going through wheel bearings about every 30K. But I started buying used ones. For $25 a pop, I don't care if they last 15K. Just make sure to keep everything limbered up so you can change them on the trail if you're 300 miles from home.

[skawtydog]

Yeah, James, I did read the sticky already, but couldn't visualize what you meant. But, after reading it a couple more times, I think I finally understand. And i found this...now I'm sure i understand:

Wheel Spacing for "People Like Me" (I am not a dummy, damn it...just couldn't visualize)

1. Jack up one corner of your Trailblazer, making sure that at least one of the wheels on the ground is blocked in front and in the rear of the tire so the rig doesn't move.
2. Take the wheel completely off your Trailblazer.
3. Lay it flat on the ground with the part of the rim that faces to the outside of your rig down.
4. Place a straight edge across the part of the rim now facing up which should be the inside for your rim.
5. Using a tape measure, yardstick or ruler to measure from where the holes are in your rim are that the wheel studs go through to the part of the straight edge resting on the rim.
6. You now have your backspacing.

Geez, for a such a simple subject that took me a while....must be my old age..hehehe!

Thanks for your patience, I do appreciate it!
Skawtydog

[skawtydog]

And i absolutely agree with Roadie and James's last comments...I believe if this is something I want to do to my Trailblazer (lift, larger tires), and off-road is where where I am going to be, wheel bearings wearing out faster will become a "fact of life" for me. Que sera, sera.

Skawtydog

[Trail X]

Hehe... my wheel bearing got water in it... I've got to stop doing deep water crossings.

[skawtydog]

Got a call from my office today (wow, on a Sunday even!) and I am back to work Tuesday! So I am that much closer to getting this done. No offroadtb for at least 2 weeks, the engineering companies only very rarely give us high-speed satellite internet in camp in the middle of the woods, but this means that i will begin ordering parts soon.....and I'm getting that much closer to the goal!!

[HARDTRAILZ]

255 is a decent all-purpose width. Keep in mind that the wider your ties get, the more rolling resistance you get, thus the lower gas mileage. With my set up (255 width M/Ts), I regularly get 17 mpg on the highway (per the scangauge).

FYI--I get this same highway mileage with my 305-65-17 Mt's on my scangauge. 16-18 it generally shows, depending on wind it seems. So I am not sure the width of tire makes that much difference in mpg.

[Trail X]

Agreed, wind is a big factor, and thus speed is one of the biggest factors.

Plus, my bumper adds a lot of resistance.

[skawtydog]

The only hole left in my grand scheme here is that I haven't even looked into a body lift, which I assume can be as important as a suspension lift (depending upon what I plan to achieve, which in my case is lots of clearance, bigger wheels and tires, etc..) The reason I haven't really looked into the body lift is simply my lack of tools for such an endeavor. But I guess the off-road shop here in the city could follow the instructions that come with the BDS body lift...

Edit: I guess it's the Zone body lift now

Cheers,
Scott

[HARDTRAILZ]

The only hole left in my grand scheme here is that I haven't even looked into a body lift, which I can only assume is as important as a suspension lift, bigger wheels and tires, etc.. The reason being my lack of tools for such an endeavor. But I guess the offroad shop down the street could follow the included instructions that come with the BDS body lift...

Body lift is easier to install than the suspension lift. BDS doesnt make one anymore, they sold their design to Zone Offroad. Nice set up if 2 inches is enough.

However it sounds that for what you are doing, and the tires you are thinking of running, you wont need a body lift. Decide on your tires and build around them so you dont end up needing to cut if you dont want. I went susp, body and cut fenders, but it was worth it to me.

[Trail X]

It's usefulness depends on who you talk to. Personally I feel a body lift is a waste of time and money. I'd much rather pour the money into suspension lifts.

It seems the body lift becomes more popular and necessary as you get into 34" tires... but personally I feel that is too big to be truly functional on the TB. 32" to 33" tires are plenty.

Body lift adds clearance for your tires, adds a little more clearance to under your doors, and makes it appear higher. However on the other hand, it raises your center of gravity, increases your wind resistance, and doesn't directly add any clearance under your frame... where you need it. Doesn't mean that I sometimes wish I had gotten one though. They do look cool.

I guess to summarize... if your mission requires 34" tires... get the body lift. If not, I'd just trim as necessary.

[bartonmd]

It's usefulness depends on who you talk to. Personally I feel a body lift is a waste of time and money. I'd much rather pour the money into suspension lifts.

It seems the body lift becomes more popular and necessary as you get into 34" tires... but personally I feel that is too big to be truly functional on the TB. 32" to 33" tires are plenty.

Body lift adds clearance for your tires, adds a little more clearance to under your doors, and makes it appear higher. However on the other hand, it raises your center of gravity, increases your wind resistance, and doesn't directly add any clearance under your frame... where you need it. Doesn't mean that I sometimes wish I had gotten one though. They do look cool.

I guess to summarize... if your mission requires 34" tires... get the body lift. If not, I'd just trim as necessary.

It doesn't get you any more direct lift, but it allows you to put on bigger tires that will get you an extra inch or so of clearance... (I know you know this, but I am adding it very specifically for anyone reading)

If you CAN do more suspension lifting (straight axle, etc), a body lift is bling, but if you've already maxed out the suspension lifting, then a body lift can be the road to getting that extra 1" of ground clearance from going 2" larger diameter on tires...

Mike

[skawtydog]

Cool, thanks for the quick replies guys! That was really the only major thing left for me to figure out and decide on, and it turns out to be a non-issue because, as you touched on, I can't ever see the need for 34's.
Sweet....that's the last major concern (pre-install) that I really had.
Oh yeah...I am having a bit of a time finding wheel spacers. I want to go from 6X5 to 6X5.5, for a much broader choice of wheels. I did have a look around last night, but couldn't find anything spacer-wise that was both wheel and hub centric, although I WAS pretty damn tired. I think I'll cruise through you guys' profiles, to get some ideas.

Drop me a line if you have any advice...I'll be cruising around here for ideas.

Thanks, as always, for the help,
Scott

[janesy86]

Wheeladapter.com is the place to go for adapters... Fred knows how to make em I hear. I went a cheaper route but kinda wish I sprung for his. The Roadie, JD, and many others got adapters/spacers from him.

Can't wait to see how you TB looks once your done! Great research done on your part.. very refreshing to see..

[HARDTRAILZ]

It doesn't get you any more direct lift, but it allows you to put on bigger tires that will get you an extra inch or so of clearance... (I know you know this, but I am adding it very specifically for anyone reading)

If you CAN do more suspension lifting (straight axle, etc), a body lift is bling, but if you've already maxed out the suspension lifting, then a body lift can be the road to getting that extra 1" of ground clearance from going 2" larger diameter on tires...

Mike

Well said. If I could have gotten 6 inches of Suspension lift, I would not have a body lift. My Suburban on 36's has no body lift because I could get where I wanted on suspension alone.

The body lift does however give me significantly more clearance under my sliders where James hit the front of his slider at TECORE 2, I would have had another 2-3 inches to get my slider to even hit.