Bug-out Vehicle - supplies, checklists, planning

[fishsticks]

Im looking at an SKS which takes AK mags for my bug out gear too,not only would it be more effective in the event of an invasion,civil uprising,major disaster or other,it would be more effective than a shotgun against the many predatory and aggressive animals at or near my bug out location.

Skip the SK-AK conversion. Been there, done that. SKS's didn't come with removable mags for a reason. That reason is they misfeed/stovepipe when equipped with them.

Get strip clips...lots of them. Load them and test them all. Aside from needing a slightly different arrangement to carry them, they are just fine. With practice, you can load one just as fast as you can drop and replace a removable mag.

Having owned 7.62x39 chambered firearms for years, I think I'd rather have an AR-15 (.223) as they seem a bit more versatile to me. A 7.62x39 round does do terrible things to whatever it hits though... and SKS's are damn near indestructable (except for that pesky floating firing pin).

[KE7WOX]

For reasons unknown to me the AR15 has overtaken the AK47 as the favorite firearm of the Mexican cartels, I'm guessing it's more precise, more quiet and less recoily than the AK.

Although I've heard that .223 ammo is getting quite expensive now in the US (I'm sure that all those Obama is banning guns rumours are created by firearm distributors to drive up the demand and prices of ARs, ammo and accessories, and seems like it works)

[fishsticks]

For reasons unknown to me the AR15 has overtaken the AK47 as the favorite firearm of the Mexican cartels, I'm guessing it's more precise, more quiet and less recoily than the AK.

For me it comes down to the ammunition quality. Most of the 7.62 ammo is steel cartridge (non-reloadable) and the consistency just isn't there for longer ranged shots. .223 seems to have a leg up even in the surplus variety, and the availability of actual brass makes reloading (and far better consistency) more available.

That being said, I own a lower and 10 mags for an AR-15, but nothing else currently. My experience is gained shooting a few AR-15s owned by a friend.

EDIT: Also noteworthy: Mounting any sort of optic to an SKS is an exercise in frustration. All the rear cover based mounts I've used shifted eventually. I've had much better luck with the iron sights. AKs are a bit better.

[KE7WOX]

A bit offtopic, but one of the school's housing staff idiots wasn't sure if having empty casings in the room was against the rules (I had several spam cans full of rounds), as she was worried i had emptied them inside the residence halls. These empty casings were about 110 7.62x39, 30 .223 and 20ish 7.62 NATO we picked up at the shooting range. yeah, I'm still trying to figure out a way of shooting 150 rifle rounds inside a drywall building without killing anyone or anyone noticing.

[SteveTB03]

For reasons unknown to me the AR15 has overtaken the AK47 as the favorite firearm of the Mexican cartels, I'm guessing it's more precise, more quiet and less recoily than the AK.

Although I've heard that .223 ammo is getting quite expensive now in the US (I'm sure that all those Obama is banning guns rumours are created by firearm distributors to drive up the demand and prices of ARs, ammo and accessories, and seems like it works)

Yes it is all true. ARs are more accurate quiet and has a ton less recoil overall its a better weapon than the AK. I've shot multiple kinds of rifles and for me I love the feel and shootability of the AR.

That's why all firearms, ammo is so expensive as soon as he bacame president gun prices sky rocketed. I wish the //// would just go away.

[KE7WOX]

Some say he was 2009s best gun salesman . you should have been to Cabela's last year, everyone was walking out with ARs

[lil_freak_66]

The firearms industry is still trying to catch up on lead times.

Stag Arms,they make AR15's.

as soon as it got to be october 2008 they started getting behind schedule,i just got an email from them a month or two ago saying they are finally back to pre-election Lead times.

I couldnt find any ammo for my Mosin nagant or any shotguns for 2-3 months after the election either.

[glfredrick]

I've had that thought many times, many,many times.

One of the most poignant (and horribly controversial) pair of short stories from when I was growing up in the 50's and reading a lot of science fiction was a post holocaust situation where the protagonist was bugging out with his useless, nagging, parasite of a wife and his outdoorsy, capable, survivalist daughter he had trained just in case of this emergency. He ditched his wife at a gas station on the way, since she would have died anyway due to lack of skills, and carried on surviving with his daughter.

"Lot" (1953) and "Lot's Daughter" (1954), Ward Moore

You didn't keep the books, did you? Might finance the next project.

http://www.amazon.com/Lot-Lots-daughter ... 845&sr=1-8

http://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl ... 20daughter


About "survival" tools for harvesting food... I am of a mind that a decent quality air rifle with 10,000 or more pointed pellets, a cleaning rod, oil, and replacement o-rings would be invaluable. Small game and birds are far more practical for day-to-day life than are large game like deer. The air rifle is virtually silent, which helps to conceal the hunter from others who may wish to have for their own what he or she has, and with 1000-1200 fps tack-driving performance, a lot of game is within reach, even deer-sized with precise placement of the shot.

[glfredrick]

I'm seriously looking into getting MREs from the internet, but you have to watch out to make sure they're genuine military ones. As an alternative, check out gun shows and surplus auctions. They often carry them, among other things. Another alternative is of course canned food (chili and rice, or chef boyardee). Anything with amino acids or a complete protein and sufficient vitamins.

Actually, a lot of people who advocate MREs do not advocate military versions. Two reasons, the military MREs available to the public are often outdated and the military versions are often laden with calories of a type suitable for pack mules (my bad, I mean soldiers) not for the health of the consumer.

"Staples" is a word that survivalists need to learn. That means "stuff" that goes with and allows you to cook and eat other foods harvested naturally. Staples are dried rice, beans, wheat, corn (all with a grinder to process), sugar, salt (more important than most people know), cooking oil, spices, etc.

http://urbansurvivalsecrets.com/general ... al-kit/16/

The link is to a blog by one particular (very opinionated!) guy who has a lot of good info on common sense survival. No recommendation for his worldviews!

[bartonmd]

It's good to have an air rifle, but a suppressed .308 bolt action is also nice...

Mike

[HARDTRAILZ]

I have read almost every one of these stories and if anyone enjoys fiction there is some tremendous writers and often some really good info contained in these.

http://www.frugalsquirrels.com/vb/forum ... .php?f=131

There is tons of info on tools, vehicles, weapons, edible plants, medical info ll wrapped in easy to digest fiction. There is often links to places to buy or research some things.


There are scenarios of being trapped in an office building or rebuilding the world after nukes or farming before and after war. There is probably something for everyone. I cant say all the stories are great, but some should be published.

There are other similar sites as well, but this one kept me coming back and now has me following a couple current stories as well.

[glfredrick]

I've found that a lot of the current genre of survivalist material centers on utter primitive survival. Unless something so radical comes along that completely wipes all traces of civilization off the face of the earth, that will likely never be the case. All the water wells will still be there. All the buildings will still be there. Vehicles will be there. supplies of all types will be there (for a while). What won't be there almost immediately in any disaster scenario that requires a "bug out" is" fuel, immediate water, immediate food, money, and "good natured" people.

Most people will be seen as a threat to survival (sadly, for together we could cope), and many will center their lives around money that will, in large part, be worthless (yes, even gold -- can't eat it). Fuel to be able to bug out will be critical, and likely the first thing to be inaccessible, figuring that the power grid is the first thing that will fail.

With time, homes, yards, even vehicles can be re-purposed (made simple) and remain usable. I've spent as much as 2 years at a time "off the grid" as far as having power, gas, water, etc., and we survived quite well, even raised up a couple of kiddos. In fact, no one else even knew what we were doing. We grew or harvested our own food (almost entirely -- our food budget for purchases was dictated by any money I could raise fixing cars and houses), we heated with wood, and used water from a variety of sources. It is amazing what you can do if you need to.

[Trail X]

The show on discovery "the colony" is interesting to watch. While it's somewhat 'hollywood', it's interesting to see how people cope with real-world sort of issues. Seemed that one of the biggest concerns is safety. In the season opener (Tuesday) the 'colony' was mobbed by another group who stole all their medical supplies.

[HARDTRAILZ]

Is it new season out? I had the original recorded but my box took a shit. I had watched almost all of them though.

It is interesting, but I would have shot a couple of the original members if I was trapped with them. Did more harm than good.

The murauders or raiders or whatever make me laugh too. But it is worth watching for any knowledge you can get.

[bartonmd]

Yeah, that's pretty much THE reason to be well armed... Keeping what's yours from people desperate enough to try and take it from you...

Mike

[Trail X]

Is it new season out? I had the original recorded but my box took a shit. I had watched almost all of them though.

It is interesting, but I would have shot a couple of the original members if I was trapped with them. Did more harm than good.

The murauders or raiders or whatever make me laugh too. But it is worth watching for any knowledge you can get.

Yeah, season 2 started this week.

The marauders seem much more realistic this year (my wife doesn't like it, but I do). Apparently they can now inflict real physical pain on the volunteers.

[OregTrailBlazin]

Can't wait to start watching the colony again, heard this year is a little different already though... I wait till it comes out to rent, so I'll just have to wait and see I guess.



The most valuable items on the streets after Katrina hit was Pepsi, Beer and Cigs.. People with addictions will be one of the first to start breaking down. If you have enough of these items, you can trade the sheeple for things that are actually usable or buy your way out of situations. There's a couple different journals I've come across where they talk about trading a 6 pack of Pepsi for their wife back. Or one can of Pepsi and a pack of cigs for a box of food. The guy even put his cans of Pepsi in a bag with sand to make them uglier, so it didn't look like he had a bunch, just one ugly, rare can...

[lil_freak_66]

It's good to have an air rifle, but a suppressed .308 bolt action is also nice...

Mike

Indiana allows suppressors?

In Michigan we don't allow suppressors and SBR/SBS,but we allow AOW and full auto.
Luckily,we're lobbying to allow suppressors and SBR/SBS and its looking promising with our very pro 2A Attorney General whom is running for governor,seems to have the support of most rightn ow.

[fishsticks]

Was at the local gun show today on a quest for more 7.62x39 ammo. Didn't find much. Walked out with 45 rounds of 1987 Yugoslav surplus in brass (!!!) casings and the guy's business card. He was cash/check only and the ATM outside ran out of money.

I did grab this from him though. $50 new in the package, which is the cheapest I've seen them for.

http://shop.pipergear.com/index.php/gea ... g-251.html

[bartonmd]

It's good to have an air rifle, but a suppressed .308 bolt action is also nice...

Mike

Indiana allows suppressors?

In Michigan we don't allow suppressors and SBR/SBS,but we allow AOW and full auto.
Luckily,we're lobbying to allow suppressors and SBR/SBS and its looking promising with our very pro 2A Attorney General whom is running for governor,seems to have the support of most rightn ow.

Yes, Indiana allows all that stuff...

Was at the local gun show today on a quest for more 7.62x39 ammo. Didn't find much. Walked out with 45 rounds of 1987 Yugoslav surplus in brass (!!!) casings and the guy's business card. He was cash/check only and the ATM outside ran out of money.

I did grab this from him though. $50 new in the package, which is the cheapest I've seen them for.

http://shop.pipergear.com/index.php/gea ... g-251.html

Prices are getting pretty low... I don't even have anything that runs 7.62x39, and I've thought about getting a case...

http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm? ... 18|830|852

$200/k